irish setters

[magman44]

please tell me what you think about irish setters for bird hunting i dont have any birds in this state anymore but my family just bought a pheasent hunting lease in south dakota

[citori]

Finding a field bred Irish setter can be a very difficult prospect as they are in pretty high demand and the better kennels have a fairly deep waiting list for pups. Picking a dog from any other source will likely be a lesson in futility as the breed has been bred so much for the show ring that any hunting desire is very deeply hidden and minimal if even present. I know of three breeders personally and their waiting lists are 2-3 years out for repeat customers. New customers pick up pups as they get the chance and cannot be choosy. Getting a "Red" Setter is not much better, these are Irish Setters that have been crossed out to English Setters at various points in order to re-infuse hunting instincts and desire.
You would be much further ahead in choosing a different breed for your bird dog, Irish Setters are precariously teetering on the brink of field usefulness and the many traits and lines to look for are pretty obscure for the average person. Determining a field bred English Setter from a show dog is bad enough, doing so with Irish Setters is much more difficult.

[oneshot 1]

If I was getting a Dog I would go with German Shorthair.But its been years since I had a good Irish Setter,had best luck with the English.

oneshot

[magman44]

thanks for the replys I did not really know with way to go with my choice of breed an the only reason that I was thinking irish setter is that i had one growing up as a pet and thought it was a real good dog I am now looking into the shorthair thanks

[citori]

There are a very large number of pointing dogs one can choose from, most from decent field lines will make great partners in the field. I personally prefer English Setters and German Wirehair Pointers but over the years have had about anything imaginable and a few not so common. I feel the best bet would be to start looking at good kennels and reputable breeders in your area as they can be very good resources for help, information, and often equipment and lands in training your dog. It would also be a good idea to seek out a training club as there again would be additional resources available to you. One does not need a dog to join these clubs either, a willingness to show up and help at training days is all that is required. A great help from the more knowledgeable members is in reading pedigrees which can help you find a particular line (more or less genetic traits common and bred for within a breed by a particular breeder or group of breeders) that will more closely match you hunting needs and abilities. Some lines within a breed are geared to higher levels of competition and hunting requiring more capable trainers and the dogs can really test a new trainer. My favorite group is the North American Versatile Hunting Dog Association (NAVHDA) which focuses on the versatile or Continental breeds such as the wirehair and shorthair as well as viszlas, Brittanies, Meunsterlanders, pudelpointer, Griffon, and many others. The same techniques are also applicable to the other pointing dogs and NAVHDA does not discriminate against those breeds in any manner. These clubs are also a very good place to find good dog breedings as there are many small but very knowledgeable and ethical breeders who only do a litter every couple of years and they sell their "extra" puppies through word of mouth.
I prefer pointing dogs but there are very strong cases for flushing dogs, particularly with pheasants and new trainers. I have also had Springer Spaniels and Labs over the years and both make very good pheasant dogs. One gets more shots over flushers as anything that comes up in range is shot at (pointing dogs you typically want to point the bird first as shooting birds the dog flushes, especially with young dogs, can cause the dog to become a long range flusher) providing it is safe to do so. Newer handlers are often more comfortable with flushers as they are trained to work close and are frequently in sight. Pointing dogs should be allowed more freedom to cover ground and find birds, newer handlers are often not comfortable with this as a dog that is not in direct sight becomes a worry as the handler is not comfortable with their training nor do they trust the dog's abilities. that is another good reason to be a part of a good training group, they will also train you in the proper mindset.
If you have no strong preference as to a breed, keep your mind open and you can often come up with a great breeding for not only a reasonable price but with very good "support" from the breeder or owner. This is one reason I have had many different dog breeds over the years, I generally look first to quality breeding and then to the breed itself when picking a new pup. Best of luck

[Lodiman]

I heard the same thing about Irish setters Citori. Once a darn good bird dog, but now mostly bred for show.

[poochadamsville]

I will attest to Citori's post backed by expirience my father bought an Irish Setter pup for my brother and I christmas of 1988 due to the fact that our brittany "max" had passed on. Even at that point in time the breeders must have been going after show quality more so than hunting ability. That dog was not a bird dog at all he would not hold point or stay in any type of range no matter how much you used the collar. He was a lovable dog that ended up spending his years with us in the house just as part of the family but dumb and not a hunting dog. If I were still interested in another bird dog my preference would be another brittany or german shorthair. I have converted to a beagle guy and it dont look like I am going back. My female has 8 pups under her right now, they are three weeks old and they were all spoken for and deposited by two weeks old, all of them except one for house dogs. It seems hunting dogs are creeping into a life of luxury.

[llewellynman]

For my money you cannot find a better bird dog than the Llewellin setter. German shorthairs can be really hard headed and difficult to train. I don't know much about the Pudelpointer, but have heard some good things. And I know a guy with a setter/lab mixed breed pup that is one of the best bird dogs I've ever been around. The lab dad got in the yard with the setter bitch when she was in heat and the breeder gave the pups away. I know two of the guys who took pups as hunting dogs and they both rave about them.

So much for pure bloodlines!

The Llewellin has the gentle family dog personality of the labs and goldens, with the nose and hunting drive of the best breeds out there. They are smart, eager to please and easy to train. There aren't many breeders and you may have to wait some time, but in my humble opinion, there isn't a finer dog in the field.