new to muzzleloading

[6176a]

I just bought an encore pro hunter and am excited about getting into muzzleloading. I have a quick question on wich rounds to use. Do you think it's better to use the pre-packaged sabots or using mm sabots with various .45 caliber handgun bullets? I like the idea of searching for that perfect round.

[wranglerdude]

It is probably cheaper to buy the sabots and bullets seperately. I just did that. Ordered MMP sabots directly from them and bought bullets from Cabela's. I am using the 45 caliber Hornady 250 grain XTP. MMP can advise you as to the correct sabot for the bullet you choose.

[rooster52]

Allways fun to find the right load and bullet combination for a new rifle.You normally cannot find that perfect combination in one setting at the range.It takes time and all so sometimes alot of money in bullets and powder.
Muzzleloader shooting is alot of fun,but it sure isn't cheap!

[jpfishmaster]

I'll second the 250gr Hornady XTP; I shoot them from my Encore with 100gr of 777 with great results.

[Pine Buck]

Congrats on the Encore!!! They are an amazing rifle!!

Have fun with it :)

[creteham]

I can't answer your question, but from what I've learned, be prepared to burn a lot of powder to get good with your new piece. Pick a single projectile and a single powder load and stick with it for DOZENS of shots 'till you get used to the thing, and see how it patterns with that load. Then start experimenting with different projectiles, propellant volume, propellant, etc., giving each one more than a "3 shot and call it good" test. That to me is the most fun. Lots of time shooting! When you find "it", you can feel confident that you can hit what you're aiming at consistently with that load. Then you can try a different combination and go through the same process. Just my thoughts. "Your Mileage May Vary."
Good Luck

[buckconner]

Over the years we have done a little testing on muzzle loading projectiles, this list may be of some help.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LOAD TESTS REMINGTON 700 ML - .50 CALIBER (muzzle loader).
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.50 CALIBER SABOT PROJECTILES (Pyrodex Powder – using 25, 30, and 50 grain pellet combinations).

PROJECTILE GRAIN WEIGHT B. P. CHARGE (GRAINS) M. V. (FEET PER SECOND) M. E. (FOOT POUNDS)

Core-Lok® JHP 275
80 grs. FFg 1430 f.ps. 1271 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1495 f.ps. 1372 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1560 f.ps. 1481 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1592 f.ps. 1573 ft.-lbs.

Hornady® JHP 275
80 grs. FFg 1450 f.ps. 1286 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1505 f.ps. 1391 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1568 f.ps. 1492 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1596 f.ps. 1584 ft.-lbs.

ThompsonCenter® ShockWave - JHP 275
90 grs. FFg 1448 f.ps. 1278 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1498 f.ps. 1483 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1563 f.ps. 1486 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1594 f.ps. 1579 ft.-lbs.

PowerBelt® JHP 275
90 grs. FFg 1442 f.ps. 1271 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1481 f.ps. 1478 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1551 f.ps. 1489 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1598 f.ps. 1583 ft.-lbs.

Barnes Bullets® JHP 275
90 grs. FFg 1610 f.ps. 1564 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1745 f.ps. 1726 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1821 f.ps. 1789 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1853 f.ps. 1827 ft.-lbs.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.50 CALIBER LEAD LUBED CONICALS (Pyrodex Powder – using 25, 30, and 50 grain pellet combinations).

PROJECTILE GRAIN WEIGHT B. P. CHARGE (GRAINS) M. V. (FEET PER SECOND) M. E. (FOOT POUNDS)

Hornady® JHP 275
80 grs. FFg 1362 f.ps. 1474 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1415 f.ps. 1598 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1439 f.ps. 1763 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1528 f.ps. 1886 ft.-lbs.

ThompsonCenter® ShockWave - JHP 275
90 grs. FFg 1315 f.ps. 1478 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1378 f.ps. 1609 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1439 f.ps. 1762 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1486 f.ps. 1849 ft.-lbs.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.50 CALIBER PATCHED ROUND BALLS (Pyrodex Powder – using 25, 30, and 50 grain pellet combinations).

PROJECTILE GRAIN B. P. CHARGE (GRAINS) M. V. (FEET PER SECOND) M. E. (FOOT POUNDS)

Hornady® RD.BALL 179
80 grs. FFg 1650 f.ps. 1092 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1753 f.ps. 1195 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1841 f.ps. 1347 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 2043 f.ps. 1672 ft.-lbs.

ThompsonCenter® RD.BALL 182
90 grs. FFg 1641 f.ps. 1087 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1742 f.ps. 1183 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1821 f.ps. 1332 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1981 f.ps. 1598 ft.-lbs.

DixieGunWorks® RD.BALL 179
90 grs. FFg 1639 f.ps. 1656 ft.-lbs.
100 grs. FFg 1737 f.ps. 1142 ft.-lbs.
125 grs. FFg 1811 f.ps. 1576 ft.-lbs.
130 grs. FFg 1929 f.ps. 1627 ft.-lbs.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[.358 MAN]

Your best bet is to go with powerbelt bullets. They are full caliber. Sabots decrease your caliber size. Example a 50 cal. becomes a 45 cal. Use the full potnential of your muzzelloader.

[scrat]

Keep your options open and use what you can to see what best fits you and what you are shooting. Example i bought some jacketed sabots for my 50 shooting 45 jacketed. i tried different grains of powders then wrote down my results. Then cost of the bullets. Then i bought some hornady 410 grn lead and shot them. wrote down results. Then i used some plain sabots with different 45 cal bullets. again shot a bunch and wrote down my results. then after carefull consideration i purchased a lee R.E.A. L bullet mold 320 grain. Then i casted up some 50 bullets. Fired several different rounds. So i have used up around 7 different types of bullets. Which ones am i using for my firearm. Easy. The Lee R.E.A.L bullets. Here is why

Cost. i can make bullets for pennies on the dollar. Example hornady 410 10.99 a box. For 20 bullets. Thats basicly 53 cents a bullet. The lee i can make them for about .02 cents a bullet.

Clean up.
Using sabots i found every other round i was running a brush down the bore. NICE

With The Lee. The bullet pretty much cleans up itself. Its designed to expand and almost clean the barrel as you fire. Very little clean up between rounds. Can go pretty much 10 rounds or more.

Accuracy. Though some of the sabots gave me some impressive results. The hornaday 410 did not. My thinking due to the weight. i had to give it a heavier charge to get the same results as sabots. Then when i started to use the lee. I found that my accuracy was way better than the hornadays 410. And close if not better than the sabots. One thing the nice clean cut round holes on paper were awesome. Most of the sabots gave me torn holes. So money wise and accuracy wise hands down the Lee R.E.A. L bullet is an awesome investment.

[buckconner]

Keep your options open and use what you can to see what best fits you and what you are shooting. Example i bought some jacketed sabots for my 50 shooting 45 jacketed. i tried different grains of powders then wrote down my results. Then cost of the bullets. Then i bought some hornady 410 grn lead and shot them. wrote down results. Then i used some plain sabots with different 45 cal bullets. again shot a bunch and wrote down my results. then after carefull consideration i purchased a lee R.E.A. L bullet mold 320 grain. Then i casted up some 50 bullets. Fired several different rounds. So i have used up around 7 different types of bullets. Which ones am i using for my firearm. Easy. The Lee R.E.A.L bullets. Here is why

Cost. i can make bullets for pennies on the dollar. Example hornady 410 10.99 a box. For 20 bullets. Thats basicly 53 cents a bullet. The lee i can make them for about .02 cents a bullet.

Clean up.
Using sabots i found every other round i was running a brush down the bore. NICE

With The Lee. The bullet pretty much cleans up itself. Its designed to expand and almost clean the barrel as you fire. Very little clean up between rounds. Can go pretty much 10 rounds or more.

Accuracy. Though some of the sabots gave me some impressive results. The hornaday 410 did not. My thinking due to the weight. i had to give it a heavier charge to get the same results as sabots. Then when i started to use the lee. I found that my accuracy was way better than the hornadays 410. And close if not better than the sabots. One thing the nice clean cut round holes on paper were awesome. Most of the sabots gave me torn holes. So money wise and accuracy wise hands down the Lee R.E.A. L bullet is an awesome investment.

GOOD POST....

Buck

[6176a]

Ok I like the idea of casting my own bullets, but where do I get started. How do you do this?

[buckconner]

Ok I like the idea of casting my own bullets, but where do I get started. How do you do this?

You will need a source for clean lead, range lead usually is a lot of work with cleaning and testing for hardness. Clean lead is still available you just need to check around the shootin' shops, junk yards or plumbing shops (since plastic piping has come on so strong some have stopped using anything lead). I use a Safeco Hardness Tester when buying any large amount, some will try and push wheel weights, now that stuff is really harder than we shoot. After you have the lead worked out look at the different melting pots and molds available, Cabela's has a line of these in the 2008 Catalog, or go to Midway, Log Cabin Sports Shop, Track of the Wolf, and so on for these items. Lyman has some good information on making bullets and recipes for mixing lead for the right hardness. Once you have gathered everything then its trial and error for your first few pours to get a feel as to how hot to get you mold and so on for the perfect bullet, not hard just takes some testing.

Buck

[creteham]

Ok I like the idea of casting my own bullets, but where do I get started. How do you do this?

Here's a source for lot's of BP moulds:

http://leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1199723933.5506=/html/catalog/blackpow.html


creteham

[for-ccw]

can`t shoot powerbelts in mine. tried different weights and powders. wish i could. best i can get so far is 250grn. t/c shockwaves or 250grn hornady sst with 120grns 777. the drier the barrel the better but swabbed before each shot. you might try these loads at range but as everyone has stated you have to find that "sweet spot". have fun. also remember if you shoot 777 powder that it is about 15% hotter than say pyrodex or american pioneer. i.e 120grns of 777 = 150 grns pyro or app.